heavy rain going through huge puddle and splash water cause my bmw f30 320i down

[patgwh]

Pls read the link that I post...One of the BMW owner complaint kena 38k change engine go through puddle

Yes, very unfortunate incident. Did you escalate your plight to BMW Malaysia instead of just the dealership? Which dealer workshop that you bring your car to?

 

[seng8882]

Ok tomorrow go see manager ciakap baik baik if still cannot mau cari gaduh....call all member gathering next day

 

[patgwh]

Salesman told me bmw the air filter easy suck water cause engine damaged after my car involved this incident ,he should advice me buy optional insurance or advice pls don't drive through puddles or pls don't drive when raining before I buy this car.

The dealership and BMW Malaysia are two separate companies. Maybe the principal can assist you if you contact them. Can you share which workshop you go to fellow forumers?

 

[dzuljazz2001]

RULE of THUMB .... no matter what model car you drive, old skool or the latest models, DO NOT drive your car through puddles, especially in deep water puddles!. If you do, it will be at owner's risk! Sad too say but no warranty will cover that unless you take an additional coverage, which can be quite hefty and at the discretion of the insurer to accept it or not ... I do feel for you bro ... :frown:..

Do come to our OTT at Sunway and I will explain to you more :frown: ....

Yes, very unfortunate incident. Did you escalate your plight to BMW Malaysia instead of just the dealership? Which dealer workshop that you bring your car to?

Salesman told me bmw the air filter easy suck water cause engine damaged after my car involved this incident ,he should advice me buy optional insurance or advice pls don't drive through puddles or pls don't drive when raining before I buy this car.

Pls read the link that I post...One of the BMW owner complaint kena 38k change engine go through puddle

The sale advisor told me don't start the engine but the service advisor is indian speak tamil teach the Indian tow truck guy how to put the gear to neutral maybe got start few times...habis

 

[seng8882]

RULE of THUMB .... no matter what model car you drive, old skool or the latest models, DO NOT drive your car through puddles, especially in deep water puddles!. If you do, it will be at owner's risk! Sad too say but no warranty will cover that unless you take an additional coverage, which can be quite hefty and at the discretion of the insurer to accept it or not ... I do feel for you bro ... :frown:..

Do come to our OTT at Sunway and I will explain to you more :frown: ....

all cars can go through except mine?

 

[patgwh]

RULE of THUMB .... no matter what model car you drive, old skool or the latest models, DO NOT drive your car through puddles, especially in deep water puddles!. If you do, it will be at owner's risk! Sad too say but no warranty will cover that unless you take an additional coverage, which can be quite hefty and at the discretion of the insurer to accept it or not ... I do feel for you bro ... :frown:..

Do come to our OTT at Sunway and I will explain to you more :frown: ....

I will try to make it if I'm around town. Cheers.

 

[Daniel E30]

Bro, i saw yr car and passed a few times ferrying my kids. I have to say during that moment, d rain was extremly heavy. The inner road u came out from is acually higher than the main road. Infact that huge puddle is there each time it rains. It was a mere bad luck for u as during that moment vehicles passing through that puddle increased the level of water towarss yr car. I hope the matter is resolved. Yr car was there for hours......

 

[jarance]

Bro, i saw yr car and passed a few times ferrying my kids. I have to say during that moment, d rain was extremly heavy. The inner road u came out from is acually higher than the main road. Infact that huge puddle is there each time it rains. It was a mere bad luck for u as during that moment vehicles passing through that puddle increased the level of water towarss yr car. I hope the matter is resolved. Yr car was there for hours......

Daniel, how was the depth of the puddle when it was raining heavily?
Most probably the depth would be deeper due to the wave from passing lorry. If the water level is higher than the exhaust, chances of the car stalling is very high.

From the picture posted, it look like the rain have stopped and car stalled there earlier while crossing the puddle.

 

[irfan80]

Ohhh boy!!!

 

[Daniel E30]

i had to slow down my exora to pass the area. I strongly believe its 1 feet or more at the deepest level. The higher inner roads heading to the main means the cars nose is heading down. Its still very painfull to see and i understand how this owner felt. the car was there for hours, and i saw many huge trucks, buses and etc squeezing through the car to pass. Anyhow, i think the service centre should not charge you for trouble shooting, and instead make a free check and only charge for the repairs and workmanship done.

 

[dzuljazz2001]

all cars can go through except mine?

Noted bro and like I have mention, its the risk you are taking. If you are lucky, then good for you but if not, than a big headache :frown:.

The last flood situation that created havocs in Kuantan (last week of Dec 2012) had a few BMWs submerged including one of our Committee Member and his damaged is still unknown. Infact his car was pushed out of the the was capture on camera and made front page in Harian Metro the following day. However, 2 cars tried to restart and thats when the damaged is done! The others escape with only their ego slightly dented.

Going thru town that day, noticed a few cars went thru huge puddles without any "damaged". Indeed they were lucky. 1 Saga, 2 Civic and a Vios was however not so lucky. Their engine stalled! The Civics and Vios had their cars pushed out of the puddles but the Saga tried to restart and suffered extensive damaged.

So, its not all about what car you drive but rather how you drive and what was your immediate reaction when your engine stalled, thats the key to "maximising" or "minimising" damaged. ....

I will share more soon but for the moment, its a bitter pill to swallow bro but sometimes we have to accept it .... I know Mr Liew, Mr Andrew and bro Kojak818 did :top: ...

 

[Devillian]

My 2cents (Hopefully it helps in some way):

I can see BMWs point of needing to check the engine before they can determine the next course of action. Though RM$10k just to inspect the engine is insane. I'm guessing they've already ruled out that it isn't the wiring? Cos if its electrical it should be easily found out through the ECU Diagnosis which surely won't cost even RM$1K. If water seeped into any part of the fuel management system, this should be easy too, since it's all outside the engine block. Then leaves that the water got through the intake and into cylinders - which would cause a major problem. But the extent of the damage can also be seen just by removing the cylinder head. Just with the head covers off you can see if the valves or valve control are bent. If those aren't, leaves the pistons and crank. This they can just remove the spark plug and do a visual check into each cylinder.

None of them though make sense for price they've given. For that price, people would basically strip every component of the engine. Your dealer should be doing a step-by-step elimination. If it's internals, than the diagnosis should be covered under the labour charge for replacement an engine internal.

Another point, given that they haven't diagnosed the problem, they have no grounds to void your warranty claiming it is flood damage. They need to check and determine what the problem, before they can say it's the flood that caused it.

If it's a design flaw, then I would bring it all the way up to BMW AG even. Malaysia may not be strict, but there are other countries that are. If BMW AG (or through BMW Malaysia), they've been notified and not take necessary action, it leaves them open to lawsuits or heavy penalties from the owners in other countries.

Hopefully I helped in some way, and if I'm wrong in anything above, do let me know..

 

[dzuljazz2001]

You are certainly on the button there bro. RM10K is worst than daylight robbery and at the end of the day, if its indeed a "design flaw", go to the Tribunal immediately to file an official complaint. I know they (the Kementerian) do take this things very seriously as i have gone thru it myself.

Trouble shooting is just like you have mention and if you do have the right tool, a DIY can easily be done.

Keep us updated bro seng8888 and we will try to assist where possible. .. :top: ..

My 2cents (Hopefully it helps in some way):

I can see BMWs point of needing to check the engine before they can determine the next course of action. Though RM$10k just to inspect the engine is insane. I'm guessing they've already ruled out that it isn't the wiring? Cos if its electrical it should be easily found out through the ECU Diagnosis which surely won't cost even RM$1K. If water seeped into any part of the fuel management system, this should be easy too, since it's all outside the engine block. Then leaves that the water got through the intake and into cylinders - which would cause a major problem. But the extent of the damage can also be seen just by removing the cylinder head. Just with the head covers off you can see if the valves or valve control are bent. If those aren't, leaves the pistons and crank. This they can just remove the spark plug and do a visual check into each cylinder.

None of them though make sense for price they've given. For that price, people would basically strip every component of the engine. Your dealer should be doing a step-by-step elimination. If it's internals, than the diagnosis should be covered under the labour charge for replacement an engine internal.

Another point, given that they haven't diagnosed the problem, they have no grounds to void your warranty claiming it is flood damage. They need to check and determine what the problem, before they can say it's the flood that caused it.

If it's a design flaw, then I would bring it all the way up to BMW AG even. Malaysia may not be strict, but there are other countries that are. If BMW AG (or through BMW Malaysia), they've been notified and not take necessary action, it leaves them open to lawsuits or heavy penalties from the owners in other countries.

Hopefully I helped in some way, and if I'm wrong in anything above, do let me know..

 

[Strider74]

Try to get a breakdown on the charges, see one by one what they are charging you for.
Get a proper quotation before agreeing to any repairs.
It is unfortunate that this happened to you, i understand that you are emotionally charged (i would) but dont let this cloud your mind and judgement.
All the best bro.

 

[jennypenny]

and thats why when Insurance sales agent recommends Coverage for Floods people usually scoff at them. it is necessary for Malaysia with rains like ours.

hope everything is ok for you.

however, i think it is unlikely a design flaw, as it will be difficult to prove.

how do you simulate this? splash a brand new F30 with a large container and see if it stalls?

most car companies have rules of recall. they will calculate the cost of recall vs. the cost of lawsuits. if one, either is larger than the other, you will see some sort of action. if not, nothing will be done and the Consumer will be on their own.

 

[Devillian]

I do agree it's very unlikely to be a design flaw. As the OP and a few other posters have mentioned, that most people manage to get through ok. So it would be a unique sequence of events that would have led to his car failure.

But still, hard to justify the cost they are charging just for an intial check. Especially if after the checks, he carries on to get the problem corrected through the dealer. I would think the diagnosis should be free, unless after the checks he decides against the repair and brings the car elsewhere.

and thats why when Insurance sales agent recommends Coverage for Floods people usually scoff at them. it is necessary for Malaysia with rains like ours.

hope everything is ok for you.

however, i think it is unlikely a design flaw, as it will be difficult to prove.

how do you simulate this? splash a brand new F30 with a large container and see if it stalls?

most car companies have rules of recall. they will calculate the cost of recall vs. the cost of lawsuits. if one, either is larger than the other, you will see some sort of action. if not, nothing will be done and the Consumer will be on their own.

 

[jennypenny]

I do agree it's very unlikely to be a design flaw. As the OP and a few other posters have mentioned, that most people manage to get through ok. So it would be a unique sequence of events that would have led to his car failure.

But still, hard to justify the cost they are charging just for an intial check. Especially if after the checks, he carries on to get the problem corrected through the dealer. I would think the diagnosis should be free, unless after the checks he decides against the repair and brings the car elsewhere.

i think the owner needs to ask if the checks cost money. because, when a person is admitted into the hospital, he usually wont ask how much. just allowing the doctor to "check" away. maybe he was informed that it will cost "some"money? also, BMW should manage your expectation about the cost of checks. because 10k, is a lot of money. i do believe that BMW had to open up a lot of parts and check which cost time and money, so it cannot be free.

1) BMW should inform that these checks cost money upfront.
2) owner agrees and proceed to leaving car there.
3) BMW should update owner if cost of checking will go up. Either more parts need to be checked and opened.
4) owner can say no, because its too pricey? but can also, allow BMW to continue their checks.
5) BMW to provide owner with estimated cost of repair and diagnosis.

then owners feel safer. the thing about water, is that it "infects" everywhere.

 

[willy5]

This has been a problem since the days of the e36 and many other models as well. It is water being sucked into the engine not coming in through the exhaust. The exhaust always maintains a positive pressure as long as the engine is running, there is no way flood waters can come in thru the exhaust.

BMW tends to locate the intake very low in order to get cool air. In most models, lower than the headlights. If you attempt to cross water more than depths of 6 inches, you run a risk of sucking water into the engine.

If you are forced to drive thru flood waters, make sure you are not following another vehicle, if the car in front stops, the waves closing the wake will flood your engine compartment. Also make sure there are no vehicles coming from the opposite side making waves that can flood you engine.

Keep you engine revs as low as possible, 2nd gear or 3rd gear (you need try this out coz I think our 8 speed transmissions automatically select 1st gear when slow), and crawl very slowly. This is to keep the suction at the intake as low as possible. Do not rev your engine.

I have not looked at the F30 yet, but in some of the non turbo engines you can disconnect the piping before the air filter to isolate the lower sections of the intake manifold so that it is not sucking air from the bottom.

If for some reason, the car stalls in water, NEVER try to restart! Just get it towed to the workshop, have them clean out the engine of water. If you are lucky, no permanent damage is sustained. It will cost RM50,000 or whatever if you try restart.

Hope this helps.

On claims on this kind of damage, water being sucked into the engine, for the e36, we wrote to BMW Germany and their response was "please refer to your local service center", eventually my friend had to pay for the repairs, valves bent and stuff like that. Back in 1996, it cost RM13,000 for the 318i, the car was a few months old. SO this is not new to BMW.

 

[Devillian]

Which would somewhat go towards my step-by-step elimination. So they should inform the customer on what are the different possibilities and how much he's looking at in each scenario for repairs.
But I still think that checks (if followed by repairs) shouldn't be that much. Say the worse case scenario = blown piston. Then the cost of removing the engine block and stripping it, should be under labour charge for repair. Cos it isn't like they are going to take it apart, realise it's broken, put it back together, and re-bill him on repair to open it up again. On that note - I think the owner mentioned RM$30K if something internal is broken? I think that is an insane price too... for that you can get a whole complete block and just transplant it.

i think the owner needs to ask if the checks cost money. because, when a person is admitted into the hospital, he usually wont ask how much. just allowing the doctor to "check" away. maybe he was informed that it will cost "some"money? also, BMW should manage your expectation about the cost of checks. because 10k, is a lot of money. i do believe that BMW had to open up a lot of parts and check which cost time and money, so it cannot be free.

1) BMW should inform that these checks cost money upfront.
2) owner agrees and proceed to leaving car there.
3) BMW should update owner if cost of checking will go up. Either more parts need to be checked and opened.
4) owner can say no, because its too pricey? but can also, allow BMW to continue their checks.
5) BMW to provide owner with estimated cost of repair and diagnosis.

then owners feel safer. the thing about water, is that it "infects" everywhere.

 

[dzuljazz2001]

Indeed it is insane ... in Kuantan the BMW did a free check on the stalled car and have provided a list of parts tht needs to be changed. Upon approval and agreement by the owner, then only will they order the said parts :top: ...