POLL on BMW Club Annual Fees

[venonh]

Hi people, would like to know on what do you think regarding the Annual fees that is gonna be implemented by BmwClub Malaysia.

First Year you will have to pay RM 300 with some merchandise. Second year onwards RM150 annually.

Your feedback is much appreciated. Cheers..

[harry6potter]

Are you a member officially yet? I do not see your name on the list of "form submitted" and "paid". So, if you have not been registered as a member of the BMW Club Malaysia, as recognised by the ROS, the discussion of the said club fees are in layman's terms, "None of your business.":cool:

[venonh]

Are you a member officially yet? I do not see your name on the list of "form submitted" and "paid". So, if you have not been registered as a member of the BMW Club Malaysia, as recognised by the ROS, the discussion of the said club fees are in layman's terms, "None of your business.":cool:

Will wait for the poll to decide whether should i be part of the "official" member or not. If i am already a member, y should i pull out a poll? lolx.

Thanks

[vincent]

Are you a member officially yet? I do not see your name on the list of "form submitted" and "paid". So, if you have not been registered as a member of the BMW Club Malaysia, as recognised by the ROS, the discussion of the said club fees are in layman's terms, "None of your business.":cool:




there see ,, what i said has come true ... sure kena taruk form left and right



but dear harry potter , this is a poll here ,u have your right not to do the poll but u dont lar come here and personal attack this guy here .....what lar you ....

[harry6potter]

The choice to join is yours. However, the Club's joining and annual fees are not. So, until you become a member and the Club decides during its AGM or EGM to abolish it, you can poll until the cows come home.

If people join clubs because of its annual fees, then I believe that the right club for you is club soda or club sandwich. Even those are not free.

Posting service provided on this website have been provided to you now by the BMW Club Malaysia with their compliments. So, posting polls which attempt to contradict with the objectives of the club is deemed disrespectful and should not be allowed to continue. I have alerted the Committee and the Moderators on this matter, and I hope that your name will be "specially" considered when approving membership later on.

[venonh]

Sure no problem mate. Thanks for your advice though. I did this with permission and advice from the committee so no worries mate. Cheers.

[anxious]

I am not a member of the club but have been visiting this site and its predecessor for almost 4 years now.

Personally I wouldnt mind paying a yearly fee to be a member but the proposed fee seems to be a bit steep.

Anyway would non members still be able to access the site and post on it.

Thanks.

[venonh]

I am not a member of the club but have been visiting this site and its predecessor for almost 4 years now.

Personally I wouldnt mind paying a yearly fee to be a member but the proposed fee seems to be a bit steep.

Anyway would non members still be able to access the site and post on it.

Thanks.

I guess the committee wil answer your question..

Thanks. Cheers mate.

[jeffreyewe]

Dear venonh

With all due respect, you have every right to put a poll in regards to this matter BUT havin said you have permission from a committee member. WHO? might i ask?

As the Vice President of the club, and if memory serves me right..NONE of the committees has forwarded any messages to me in regards to have giving permission to anyone pertaining your request. Not that permission is required by any member of the club to come up with a poll .

Do PM me the committee's name . Thank You!

The Fee structure has been asked and polled before and the amount was agreed plus approved by ROS.

[venonh]

Hello dear Vp,

Pmed you the names d. Not permission actually. It's just that they ASKed to do it. So i'm here to help out.

Cheers bro.

[vincent]

guys pls be sincere and do this poll ....those who have not pen down the name under official members listings, pls cast yr vote

[jarance]

I would sincerly hope that the members would understand that the fees collected are for the betterment of the club and its members. Without the support of the members there is no club.. please vote wisely.

[sithwarrior]

guys pls be sincere and do this poll ....those who have pen down the name under official members listings, pls cast yr vote


Vincent with due respect have you seen the tittle of this thread ? Should fees be implemented ? If you are as fair a person as you say you are, then I suggest you think about it. Not taking a piss at you, but I think there would have been a better way to phrase your tittle.

[OSFlanker]

The phrasing of the poll is unfortunate and points to a bias from the originator of the poll. Those who have studied statistics will know that any poll can be made to skew towards an outcome with the correct phrasing.

The poll question "Should Annual Fees be Implemented" points to a challenge on the concept of charging annual fees. Firstly, I am not aware of any registered car club which doesn't collect annual fees. Secondly, from the responses posted, entrance fee is also an issue but the poll only mentions the annual fees.

A more neutral phrasing could be as follows :

"What is your opinion on the RM150 annual membership fee and the RM150 membership entrance fee?"

with the list of alternative responses as :

1. The fees set are reasonable
2. The fees set are too high
3. The annual fee is reasonable but the entrance fee is too high

"I don't care" should not be an option as this a poll and those that don't care should not take part in any poll at all! Instead of "I don't care" should be "none of the above".

[XXX]

First and foremost thank you harry6potter for ur support towards this clubs cause.

Come on Vincent and Venonh I asked you to do the poll based on whether its justifiable to pay RM300, not if we should implement Fees.

Ok i think its only fair for those not in the know what is this all abt b4 u decide to poll.

As you all know the club is now a 'Realworld Cub' not a 'Cyberspace Club' anymore since it has been registered with the Registrar of Societies which is based on Planet Earth.This club is now like a Listed Company. How does a Listed Company get its funds? its by selling shares of the company to the public and from there they use the money to invest further. As you know offer prices for shares by this companies are not the same all the time. Those well known company with good fundamentals, their issue price would be higher.

Ok coming back to the club.Like I said we are now like a Listed Company so we need funds, how we get this funds is by recruitment of members. Why was the Fee set as it is? its bcos we consider the BMW Brand as not a normal brand but of a higher standard so the need to set a certain standard in its pricing. Why? bcos the clubs investments would be to try to bring this club to the BMW Standard we all know and as you all know that is not goin to be cheap. eg: The major events now henceforth once the Official Club is launched will be organised by Professional Event Management Companies and not the free labour of the committee anymore. The committees job would be to spend your money wisely for your benefit and of its members and also the overall welfare of the club. Also like a Listed company where its accounts are audited yearly, this club will now have to go through the same procedure to let the shareholders/members know where their money went. As in any company there is a vision and so has the club.. such as a club hse ect. and for this visions to become reality there is the need of funds. Also this figure was not plucked out from the sky but with consultation of its members but this was sometime ago as it had to be in the constitution that was handed to ROS for our clubs application and you all know how long ago that was, its only now we got the confirmation that our application has been accepted as such alot of you especially those who are very new think that you were not consulted and we did this overnight. For those who need to read the clubs constitution rgdg the fees can pls ask for it and we will gladly do so. Infact we will be posting it up soon.

Another reason for the fee structure is also bcos the club wanted members who are passionate abt the brand BMW and as such will in turn be passionate members of the club and not spammers or salesman to put it in simple english Quality Members.This again was the consensus of members back then as they preferred quality to quantity.Bcos if you are passionate abt BMW u would think it is a fair price to pay to be in a club that shares that same passion bcos in the first place if you are not passionate abt the brand why did u pay an arm and a leg to own the BMW brand when there are cheaper brands out there to own. You can turn around and say hey my car only cost RM30k that doesnt make me a rich person just bcos I own a BMW, its not about rich or poor its just that u just willingly paid RM30k for a 16 year old car, WHY? bcos ur passionate abt the brand, but the bonus is that the perception value of ur RM30k car is worth more than that. (ever notice how people see you in a different light when you drive a BMW eventhough it could be 16 years old)

One other thing which I want to highlight is that out of the RM300 one pays RM150 which is a one time registration fee and an annual fee of RM150 so technically one pays only RM150 bcos the registration fee will sort off pay by itself in terms of one receiving a members pack which will consist of a club shirt that will be only available to members and not sold individually , cap , number plate holder and even more stuff as we get more merchants or sponsors along the way.
Pls dont say I dont need the cap or shirt bcos i dont need it, dont forget we are now like a company so it is advisable for its employees to have some sort of corporate image so if its an option some have and some dont have it wouldnt look good wouldnt it, like I said we carry the brand BMW we need to set certain standards as well. One will also receive a membership card to show that u r a proud member of BMW Club which will also act as a privilege or discount card.

A Calendar of events is being currently drawn out by the current protem committee. We cannot look very far at this current moment bcos as you all know once we have enough members we must have a AGM to elect new office bearers, so we do not want to suddenly handover huge tasks to the new office bearers to take over and be blamed for not being considerate.

[XXX]

ok now you all know who is the commitee that they mentioned abt but what I ask them to post are inline with what OS Flanker posted... and not abt not implementing of Fees.

[vincent]

about the poll title , what is wrong ??? it is a question and a poll to judge the result.

i really i dont understand unless is unfair to you...

tht should be a topic rite , is good to have another option says "yes but less fees" to be fair to members ...

this not to discriminate anyone here ....

[XXX]

Pls read OS Flankers post thoroughly and digest it first b4 u shoot yourself in the foot...

[ALBundy]

Anyway....despite the skewed poll, more than 70% of the folks who have casted their votes believe there should be and annual fee imposed and out of the 70%, more than 70% agreed the annual fee imposed is just and fair hahahaha!

[vincent]

i tell u what , why dont u do the poll instead , i think you can do posting also rite ...and why u ask me to do the poll here from what u said in the another forum?????

[XXX]

so I can post what I just posted up at 10:41am.....

[jarance]

Anyway....despite the skewed poll, more than 70% of the folks who have casted their votes believe there should be and annual fee imposed and out of the 70%, more than 70% agreed the annual fee imposed is just and fair hahahaha!

it still too early to tell.. so far only 40 person have voted.. but I believe the majority would voted in favour of the fee cos in the end, the fee are use for the betterment of the club and members benefits.

[jarance]

about the poll title , what is wrong ??? it is a question and a poll to judge the result.

i really i dont understand unless is unfair to you...

tht should be a topic rite , is good to have another option says "yes but less fees" to be fair to members ...

this not to discriminate anyone here ....

vincent don't worry.. Please don't take it too personal. I know your intention is good..

[sithwarrior]

The phrasing of the poll is unfortunate and points to a bias from the originator of the poll. Those who have studied statistics will know that any poll can be made to skew towards an outcome with the correct phrasing.

The poll question "Should Annual Fees be Implemented" points to a challenge on the concept of charging annual fees. Firstly, I am not aware of any registered car club which doesn't collect annual fees. Secondly, from the responses posted, entrance fee is also an issue but the poll only mentions the annual fees.

A more neutral phrasing could be as follows :

"What is your opinion on the RM150 annual membership fee and the RM150 membership entrance fee?"

with the list of alternative responses as :

1. The fees set are reasonable
2. The fees set are too high
3. The annual fee is reasonable but the entrance fee is too high

"I don't care" should not be an option as this a poll and those that don't care should not take part in any poll at all! Instead of "I don't care" should be "none of the above".

Thank You OS Flanker, but they didnt seem to understand that. How else to explain to them, I dont know..... This is the problem with these dudes lah, Give them a piece of string and they try to be cowboys... hence the birth of another club... WTF man... :mad:

[vincent]

the birth of bimmersclub.com is not to take all forumers from here to there . it is just another udmowner.com or malatbimmers.com so what about given a string and try to be cowboys ??
dont tell me anyone here cannot form their own website ????

[XXX]

but anyway thanks for getting half our job done..

[vincent]

what job ???
anyway my pleasure.......

[sithwarrior]

the birth of bimmersclub.com is not to take all forumers from here to there . it is just another udmowner.com or malatbimmers.com so what about given a string and try to be cowboys ??
dont tell me anyone here cannot form their own website ????

We are not debating about weather anyone can start their own website or not, we're just curious as to how the whole " I shall form my own club " come about. I mean something must have happened for you guys to make decissions like that right. So talk to us... whats the problem

[Alvin]

Why is this being discussed? The fees has been submitted & approved by ROS. End of story. If anyone wants to chg it or abolish it pls get voted in the new committee & make the changes. All's welcome to start campaigning. Instead of always talking from the outside, better to make a difference & make the bmwclub someting special right? If people here thk that a new management can do better, the time is just around the corner to do something about it. Rather than just talk on the forum which is easy.
Psssttt.........AGM is up soon. Only thg is u have to be a member to vote n guess what?? When u get voted in there is money in the bank for you to organise events, instead of what the current committee has which is nothing. Sounds good eh?

[harry6potter]

the birth of bimmersclub.com is not to take all forumers from here to there . it is just another udmowner.com or malatbimmers.com so what about given a string and try to be cowboys ??
dont tell me anyone here cannot form their own website ????

Sure. Please go ahead and start your own www.whinner-annonymous.com (http://www.whinner-annonymous.com) too. I am pretty sure you will have lots of company that you wouldnt feel lonely at all. ;)

[ALBundy]

On the contrary, I think everyone has their right to start their own club and we shouldnt judge them on their action. Everyone has their preference, some like missionary, doggy style, sideways, standing, corner of the bed and what not. Just because you like it doggy style doesnt not mean you are dog.

Of course in an ideal world, we should all unite under one huge umbrella. I suggest the committee to have an open session to explain the rationale behind the fees imposed and all forum members that are uncertain to participate in the club due to some uncertainties are welcome to attend and voice their concerns with respect to what ever issues.

[jeffreyewe]

Agree with Alvin's comments,

WHY are we still going on this? For the newbies, this matter was deliberated ON many many moons ago. Too bad you guys weren't around to give your 2cents thoughts. Constitution has been made, ammended, submitted and approved.

Creating splinter groups wont help in resolving this matter. This CLUB is and ONLY the OFFICIAL BMW CLUB in Malaysia and recognised by the International BMW club Council....Kapish!

Lets all concentrate on making this OFFICIAL CLUB a success instead? As what Alvin said, AGM is just around the corner...get voted in and make the changes. But remember in order to vote you have to be an official member of the club.

[Funk]

They dun get it. It's the quantum. I've been trying to drive that point home too.

[ALBundy]

The crux of the matter is this, some forum members dont agree on the quantum of amount to be paid in order to join the club and hence the formation of another splinter group.

IMO, we shouldnt criticise or chastise them over their actions. If we are really keen to attract splinter groups to join, we should explain to them the rationale behind the fee structure. If that was done, and yet they are unwilling to join, then too bad.

Simply put, many cant see the perceived value of becoming a member and its up to the committee to convince them. Like I said, its a chicken and egg situation. It takes time and effort from EVERYONE to build up the club. We are entering a new ERA now, no longer just a cyber club but a proper one, we should all be proud of it and try to chip in especially during this critical period.

Thats my dua sen.

[jarance]

so what is quantum?

It a catch 22 situation. Not enough members, sponsors not interested. No sponsor, no benefits for the members to enjoy.

In this world, most of the clubs survived on sponsors and advertisment. Without the support from you all, there is no club..

[sesat88]

On the contrary, I think everyone has their right to start their own club and we shouldnt judge them on their action. Everyone has their preference, some like missionary, doggy style, sideways, standing, corner of the bed and what not. Just because you like it doggy style doesnt not mean you are dog.

Of course in an ideal world, we should all unite under one huge umbrella. I suggest the committee to have an open session to explain the rationale behind the fees imposed and all forum members that are uncertain to participate in the club due to some uncertainties are welcome to attend and voice their concerns with respect to what ever issues.

>>> tell that to the cat! :D

[XXX]

What members? nobody has paid yet so practically we have none. We need to get people to join the club first and as this was the fee structure that was earlier
agreed upon and submitted to ROS, and only members can amend the fee structure in the next AGM as such there is nothing much we can do now. Until we have members and enough of it to set a quorum for voting purposes to elect the new committee and to change the constitution, we can debate all we want and nothings gonna come out of it.So I say we do the membership drive, get the members, vote in the new committee and let the new committee work from there. So all outhere who thinks he can do better for the club pls invest RM300 in this club and hope you get a good campaign manager if you plan to be president.


Oops sorry actually we have 1 paid up member.

[sesat88]

my 2.5 sens worth....(hopefully not offending anyone here),

Personally, i agree to Mr. Al-Bundy's comment about transparency on what the club will be embarking on in terms of benefits and activities both currently and in the future. A club has its own life cycle curve. At one point of time membership will come to a dwindle and club activities may come to a certain standstill.

Running a club is like running a business these days whereby members will want to know what will they gain out of it at the end of the day. Now the question is what is "the gain"? Will it be unique? Will it be internationally recognised? .... and so on. No gain, no business, no members. At the end of the day, it is the exposure and recognition that's wat members want. Members want to say to their kids, friends, family etc. ... look that guy's bmw has a club sticker and I am in that same club too. Be it, on the road, shopping etc.. if u follow me.

The establishing committee must be strong and dedicated to the club, not changing every AGM. New blood is one thing but old blood does keep the club running.

Lastly, you really really can't make everyone happy!

[jarance]

hei.. jerman was the first one to pay.. I think he should have more say than all of us at this moment..

[sesat88]

What members? nobody has paid yet so practically we have none. We need to get people to join the club first and as this was the fee structure that was earlier
agreed upon and submitted to ROS, and only members can amend the fee structure in the next AGM as such there is nothing much we can do now. Until we have members and enough of it to set a quorum for voting purposes to elect the new committee and to change the constitution, we can debate all we want and nothings gonna come out of it.So I say we do the membership drive, get the members, vote in the new committee and let the new committee work from there. So all outhere who thinks he can do better for the club pls invest RM300 in this club and hope you get a good campaign manager if you plan to be president.


Oops sorry actually we have 1 paid up member.


eeeehh.... u mean the pro-term committee also haven't paid??!!! :eek:

.........beep beep... cabutz!.... :D

[XXX]

yalah malufyinglah...hahahaha but what to do everyday typing inside here to make this fella happy make that fell happy no time to go to banklah...kekekke

but on a serious note we have been notified to pay up by next week...not dont want to pay take things for granted thought can pay latermah....we comm. work so hard for free thought got some special benefitmah.

[GMENG]

Like what our XXX said, all have been agreed on and submitted to ROS. So therefore for those who think that's (annual and/or registration fees) exorbitant, why dun they join first and change the constitution or whatever by-laws in the next AGM to suit their needs.

[Funk]

so what is quantum?

It a catch 22 situation. Not enough members, sponsors not interested. No sponsor, no benefits for the members to enjoy.

In this world, most of the clubs survived on sponsors and advertisment. Without the support from you all, there is no club..

Hmm... your statement reflect an opposite stance to another comm told me today that the club prefers quality members, not quantity. I guess you chaps better sit down and iron this out.

While it's a done deal having the quantum reflected in the constitution, it's never to late to change vide EGM or AGM. But I guess it's just my opinion.

Sorry about this, I don't mean to pry or cause harm.

[sithwarrior]

my 2.5 sens worth....(hopefully not offending anyone here),

Personally, i agree to Mr. Al-Bundy's comment about transparency on what the club will be embarking on in terms of benefits and activities both currently and in the future. A club has its own life cycle curve. At one point of time membership will come to a dwindle and club activities may come to a certain standstill.

Running a club is like running a business these days whereby members will want to know what will they gain out of it at the end of the day. Now the question is what is "the gain"? Will it be unique? Will it be internationally recognised? .... and so on. No gain, no business, no members. At the end of the day, it is the exposure and recognition that's wat members want. Members want to say to their kids, friends, family etc. ... look that guy's bmw has a club sticker and I am in that same club too. Be it, on the road, shopping etc.. if u follow me.

The establishing committee must be strong and dedicated to the club, not changing every AGM. New blood is one thing but old blood does keep the club running.

Lastly, you really really can't make everyone happy!

very very very very well said.... we could use someone like you in the committee wor....

[jarance]

eeeehh.... u mean the pro-term committee also haven't paid??!!! :eek:

.........beep beep... cabutz!.... :D

ya lah.. so shy lahh.. minta maaf..

[sithwarrior]

Hmm... your statement reflect an opposite stance to another comm told me today that the club prefers quality members, not quantity. I guess you chaps better sit down and iron this out.

While it's a done deal having the quantum reflected in the constitution, it's never to late to change vide EGM or AGM. But I guess it's just my opinion.

Sorry about this, I don't mean to pry or cause harm.

Bro, Your oppinions do matter and very much appreciated. keep it commin.

[sesat88]

yalah malufyinglah...hahahaha but what to do everyday typing inside here to make this fella happy make that fell happy no time to go to banklah...kekekke

but on a serious note we have been notified to pay up by next week...not dont want to pay take things for granted thought can pay latermah....we comm. work so hard for free thought got some special benefitmah.

ahhahahaah.....:o .. quick quick... then can get >1 member la.
No qualms about committee paying late... coz.. i understand.

hmmm... so who is the guy so berani to ask you all to pay up?
I wanna vote him as president!!! Boleh?

[XXX]

Hmm... your statement reflect an opposite stance to another comm told me today that the club prefers quality members, not quantity. I guess you chaps better sit down and iron this out..

but that doesnt mean we cannot get enough quality members.:)

[sithwarrior]

I just have to ask... sorry, but I just have to. For those of you who voted for no, what were you guys thinking ? I mean yeah the question was asked and you do have the right to say no, but havent you guys realise that everything we do costs us money ? So where do we get this money from if you guys think that the club should not charge a fee.... Unbelievable !!!!

[XXX]

ahhahahaah.....:o .. quick quick... then can get >1 member la.
No qualms about committee paying late... coz.. i understand.

hmmm... so who is the guy so berani to ask you all to pay up?
I wanna vote him as president!!! Boleh?

THE PRESIDENT himself ...hahahha

[sesat88]

very very very very well said.... we could use someone like you in the committee wor....

eeer...wifey sure pull the other ear if i buat demikian...... coz never spend enuff time wit her ;)

[sithwarrior]

eeer...wifey sure pull the other ear if i buat demikian...... coz never spend enuff time wit her ;)


let her meet my wifey and my wifey will teach how to cope kekekekeke

[Funk]

I suppose you chaps have a clear objective, strategies and a calender of events for the future.

Perhaps you would like to share some of these including recruitment campaign ie. your target numbers? It's a number's game honestly.

[jarance]

Hmm... your statement reflect an opposite stance to another comm told me today that the club prefers quality members, not quantity. I guess you chaps better sit down and iron this out.

While it's a done deal having the quantum reflected in the constitution, it's never to late to change vide EGM or AGM. But I guess it's just my opinion.

Sorry about this, I don't mean to pry or cause harm.

shucks, very hard to explain to you lah.. when the words are distorted.. I do not know what your intention is when you are trying to sow discord among the protem committees. We the committee may have different opinions on the type of members that we want for this club but that does NOT means we do not speak as a team.

Please registered yourself as a member and garner enough vote to be a committe member or better still be the president. Then you can change the constitution.

Sorry if I sound a bit untactful.. If you have the chance of working with the gomen personnel on the ROS approval, you will know what I meant. It not as easy to get it done as mentioned by you. The protem comm and some of the founder members have spent many months running here and there to get the ROS approved with many admentment being made in order to get it approved. Even some of the bylaws which is considered as trival such as the fees is under heavy scrutiny.

[sithwarrior]

I suppose you chaps have a clear objective, strategies and a calender of events for the future.

Perhaps you would like to share some of these including recruitment campaign ie. your target numbers? It's a number's game honestly.

yea we're in the midst of finalising it. It wont be long now. Just a hint of some of the vents. We'll be having a Penang and JB drive for sure. The mechanics will be shared with everyone later ya.

[jarance]

THE PRESIDENT himself ...hahahha

hey.. he also not yet pay.. so how? :D :D :D

[sesat88]

let her meet my wifey and my wifey will teach how to cope kekekekeke

hmmm... hopefully nothing gatal.... :D

but i be glad to assist :rolleyes: cyberly for the time being!

[Funk]

Foresaw the obvious, responded in advance and apologised in advance also can kena tiau.

***Beckons AirAsia cabin crew to give me a parachute***

Crew : Eh, you budget traveller... you have to pay want wor!

***Duh***

[Daredevil]

The Committee has discussed and decided that this Poll is not in the interest of the official BMW Club Malaysia as imposition and quantum of club fees are matters which are solely for the deliberation and decision of the official club members through the proper channels recognised by the ROS and rules governing registered societies in Malaysia.

Thank you to those who have voted. Your views will be considered by the current Committee once the Club is officially launched. In the meantime, please register yourselves as an official club member of the BMW Club Malaysia. Membership has its benefits.